Buying Marriott Destinations points

Tracy, you must have been in some very bad sales presentations! I have done a number if them over the years back when the incentives were generous. I have been treated with respect and courtesy in 100 percent. When I said "no" (more times than I said yes!) I was free to leave and treated politely.

joya8 wrote:

Tracy, you must have been in some very bad sales presentations! I have done a number if them over the years back when the incentives were generous. I have been treated with respect and courtesy in 100 percent. When I said "no" (more times than I said yes!) I was free to leave and treated politely.

Question - Have you, or anyone else, ever been to a presentation that finished within the 90 minute agreed timeframe?

Dennis-- NEVER! This one lasted 2 hours--and we were told that they were "fast-tracking" us because we understood the program! I made it clear at the start that we were not interested in buying...so I thought we were just going to get the updated information. Next time I will just tell them that if there is any push to have us buy anything we just are not going...period. When we did buy into the Destination Program they never indicated that we would be treated any differently than anyone one else buying into the program. They try and make this so complex you need to be a Philadelphia Lawyer to wade through all the fine print!

...and just as a footnote, one sales rep told me that by law they MUST get you out in the 90 minute time limit. By nature I am not a rude individual but.... I really do still wonder how legal all of this is.

Absolutely! When you are already a Marriott owner? You can absolutely control how long you are there! Just tell them you were only there for the incentive, and have zero interest in acquiring more points. They will ask you a few questions, and you are out! A friend of ours was out in 20 minutes. My husband likes to talk, so we take a little longer.

As a friend of mine would say "it's a mute point" as I will never be talked into one of those again. Informational meeting yes, sales pitch never!

By the way, they claim that 78% of Marriott VC owners have now bought into the points. Do you think that is accurate...or do you think that figure reflects all owners--including those who have just enrolled their weeks but have not bought the points? I personally find that figure hard to believe.

Kathryn - Please forgive for this long answer, but it's my nature as a retired financial officer. You can interpret this, but here's what it says in the Form 10k dated 1/3/14. Please note that MVCD is Marriott Vacation Club Destinations.

Pg 5 - "As of the end of 2013, almost 134,000 weeks-based owners have enrolled over 233,000 weeks in the MVCD program since its launch and, of these owners who have enrolled weeks with one of our sales executives, approximately 45 percent have also purchased MVCD points.

Pg 11 - "As of January 3, 2014, we operated 62 properties (under 85 management contracts) with 12,829 vacation ownership villas ("units") and approximately 420,000 owners."

My interpretation is that 134,000 weeks based owners out of 420,000 owners have enrolled their weeks, or about a third. Further, it sounds like about 45% of these 134,000 owners, have also bought points - that's about 60,000 of the 420,000 weeks based owners.

I encourage you to go on the internet and read the Form 10k, at least parts of the Business section. You'll learn about the different revenue streams, how business in done, competition, etc. If you get to the "Inventory and Development Activities" section on pg 6, you'll note that the future is "asset light" meaning Marriott's Vacations Worldwide Corp intends to buy up weeks from owners or from developers, little resort development activity, etc. It sounds like points will become the currency for vacation packages, etc. which combine products from others with Marriott products. Building and developing new properties is not part of the current business model.

I'm glad to be where I am with enrolled weeks, other weeks, and some points. Legacy owners seem to be in the best position to benefit from the future. We can also buy up some great resale weeks at wholesale prices.

Dennis-- Thank you so much for taking the time to explain all of this. Did you actually purchase trust Destination Points or are you talking about the Destination Points you get if you deposit your weeks with MCVI? The minimum they would sell us was 1250, so that amounted to about $13,000--way out of a retired person's budget! I will pull up the Form you mentioned--but I have a feeling your explanation is far better than Marriott's! I have really always respected your fully vetted, insightful and thoughtful contributions to Red Week. Thank you so much!

We bought some Trust Points in 2011, about a year after the new points program started. We were told by sales personnel that use of what we had, even enrolled week conversions to points, would be restricted without point ownership. It was like, if you don't buy, your substantial week ownership will be left in the dust.

In retrospect, we did "not need" the points! We already had enrolled weeks with conversion rights to points that equaled the rights from the newly purchased points.

Beware - Sales personnel continue to use the same "scare tactic" indicating that our points from conversion of enrolled owned weeks are less useful than new points acquired.

Great info here. Thanks.

Considering the "asset light" track Marriott is taking, does anyone know of any timeshare company committed to the development of new properties? Where are these "hot" new properties?

It may be that the timeshare market has matured to a state where the only additions will be the packaging of products owned by others. If that is the case, why would anyone buy points when they could just use cash? Does this mean that travel agencies could come back?

I did hear at the owners forum at Marriott's Grande Ocean in Hilton Head, two weeks ago, that there is a "rumor" that Marriott was going to build another property there.

What I found particularly interesting though, is that MDVC owns no points for the platinum and gold weeks, and on average, less then 11% of point stays are available through the year for Grande Ocean. I wonder how many of the sales presentation tell that to buyers of points.

Dennis-- That is exactly what they attempted to do. All I know is that anytime I have called to get a reservation I have never had any difficulty getting an exchange! We may have to wait a week or two to get a confirmation, but they have always come through--even to Hawaii and Aruba. So I am not convinced you need "Destination Club Points-on-Steroids" at all!

nanciek2 wrote:

I did hear at the owners forum at Marriott's Grande Ocean in Hilton Head, two weeks ago, that there is a "rumor" that Marriott was going to build another property there.

What I found particularly interesting though, is that MDVC owns no points for the platinum and gold weeks, and on average, less then 11% of point stays are available through the year for Grande Ocean. I wonder how many of the sales presentation tell that to buyers of points.

When they say a new Marriott property is being built, this does not mean that it is a timeshare and that the units will go into the trust for sale as points. In fact, I suspect under the new "asset light" posture, this is very unlikely. The more likely prospect is that they sell points and then go buy a "resale" unit for the trust - low price, no risk, and high margin on the transaction. Then, they are free to offer acquired packages to the point holder and rent out the unit exchanged. Vacation club just becomes a retailer, buying premium inventory for resale from owners and others. Their advantage, owners must use points acquired thru Marriott. Owners are shut out of the more competitive marketplace due to points becoming the currency.

At least, this is how I see it. This is why I like my owned weeks which I can use, exchange thru Interval, exchange for points, or rent out for "unrestricted" currency, US dollars.

I did not go into the points system. I suppose I should have when the cost was $695 to make that an option, but I am happy going to my home resort for two weeks in the summer. If I want to go somewhere else, I'm happy to try my lot my trade on Interval (which I've always gotten with request first), or rent someplace I want to go to on Redweek, and not deal with the point skim. No way would I ever buy ANYTHING else from Marriott though. Very disappointed in the changes I see with the conversion to ownership weeks to points, and the promises made by Marriott when I bought in 1996. I'm just thankful I like my home resort, and that I bought in the plat. season.

Here's a new wrinkle into the timeshare industry. My husband and I picked up a very inexpensive week at the Imperial Hawaiian Resort on Lewers Street in Honolulu--where we are at the moment. We went to an owner's forum and learned that Interval International is now going to a point system--which the Imperial is now going to use. Since our week is deeded we can keep things as they are, or pay Interval $2,995 to buy into the point system. They claim this will open up trades with all the companies that II has in their system. Has anyone out there had much success dealing with II for great trades? We certainly haven't and I strongly suspect that it's because the great properties have very little inventory to give II. Any thoughts?

I would rescind the contract now and take the time to understand what you are buying. Most timeshare and point owners, including me, have not received all that was promised. At a minimum, please call Interval to validate their new program.

Believe me, we didn't even consider buying into it! We have never achieved a good trade with them--other than working with the "Marriott Desk" at Interval! I did mention the "Marriott Desk" at Interval during our last presentation with Marriott while in Orlando last month, and she said that person was actually in their offices. Wish I had thought to ask, "Does she work for Marriott..or II?"

What is the going rental rate per point?