REDWEEKS NEW TIMESHARE EXHANGE PROGRAM

Kathleen wrote-

Sometimes it hard to tell what's top tier even here on Red Week. We own at Shawnee Ridge Top week 8 which is a red week and The Royal Haciendas Week 48 in Mexico which is a brand new 5 star resort and also a red week by Cozemel and is a Royal resort which means quality and service. The Shawnee resort is falling apart

-I couldn't agree with you more. Maybe too few people have passports? I can't imagine preferring to go to Shawnee over the Carribean in Mexico close to Can Cun/Playa del Carmen/Cozumel and the ancient ruins etc. Not only that but I own at the Haciendas, the people who own there generally have it going on not to mention the luxury and beauty of the units themselves. Who would think? Perhaps this is one of the reasons that II is changing it's ratings?

phill12 wrote:

I paid about $13,000 and own two top units at the Ridge Tahoe and love it there and this has caused problem because we have not been trading until next year to Maui! This was another reason for us buying the Tower again so we still go to Lake Tahoe in Aug 2008 for a week.

The most we ever paid for a timeshare was 10K and that was for the developer one in Orlando. It was at a gold crown resort in a brand new area and the unit we bought faced the most popular water park there at the time ..... they've since built a much larger water park with a tubing river.

We thought that 10K was outrageous (we didn't know about resales until later and until after our rescission period had past).

The most expensive resale we bought was $2900 but we got our money back when we sold it as it was a very nice RCI gold crown and 5* with II in a semi-high rise facing the Atlantic Ocean in Florida. It was the one with the 100 ft. wrap around balcony.

The second most expensive was a II 5* two bedroom in New Orleans at $2500. When I put it up for auction on Bidshares there was a bidding war and I made a little profit on it. The others were bought for very little money.

It definitely pays to shop around and do your homework. It also pays to negotiate as some people just want out from under their yearly timeshare maintenance fee albatross.

We are in agreement about people who shell out megabucks for one week of timeshare.

bigeyes1 wrote:

You know. I'm a bit disappointed in the way things are progressing with the Redweeks Exchange System. I did my part and deposited a week, which has already been claimed.

When are we going to start seeing some more deposits, specifically United States region? I'm not referring to provisional deposits, but actual deposits.

I've read in a past newsletter about all the nice incentives for early depositers, but have yet to see this. Plus, what is RW doing to promote their exchange system? Curious minds want to know.

I still have a while to search for my 2009 needs, but I was hoping for some more action by now.

bigeyes, I think that it's going to take some time for Redweek's exchange program to get off the ground and for the word get around to ALL timeshare owners.

You have to remember that Redweek's exchange program is only 2 months old (began June 21, 2007). Any new venture takes time for the word to spread. I think it will one day rise to it's potential.

bigeyes1 states, quoted in pertinent part:

>>You know. I'm a bit disappointed in the way things are progressing with the Redweeks Exchange System. I did my part and deposited a week, which has already been claimed.<< =======================================

With all due respect, RedWeek's system did / does allow you to "search first" (before depositing). Moreover, the program is literally only about 8 WEEKS old --- give it a chance!

>> I've read in a past newsletter about all the nice incentives for early depositers, but have yet to see this.<< =====================================

I have, actually. If you accept the premise (claimed by some folks but not by RedWeek itself, to be very clear on that point) that the RW "point" valuation closely approximates the weekly rental value (if it was expressed in "dollars" instead of in "points"), then some of my own weeks submitted for evaluation yielded valuations which actually EXCEEDED what I know from past personal experience to be the "market value" of a weekly rental. In short, in my own observation, RedWeek seems to be quite generous in early deposit "valuations". Ask yourself that same question about tyhe rental value of your deposited week and you might just see it a bit differently.......

>> Plus, what is RW doing to promote their exchange system? Curious minds want to know. << ======================================

I don't speak for RedWeek, but I CAN say that the (....very new, don't forget) RedWeek exchange program is both known and discussed pretty continuously on each and evey one of the several "major" timeshare sites which have "forums". I state that observation of fact as a member and participant on ALL of those sites. In short, although I have no statistics, I strongly suspect that these sites include MOST of the Internet savvy timeshare owner population out there who are in a position to (or have any interest in) "exchange". >> I still have a while to search for my 2009 needs, but I was hoping for some more action by now. << ======================================

I have a HIGH quality trader which I (unfortunately) deposited in February with RCI (my last deposit there) months before the RedWeek program even launched. I too am looking for a 2009 week --- not one word yet. It's actually pretty early for many 2009 deposits to even be available to exchange into.

In summary, my own two cents' worth is --- be patient! An exchange system like RedWeeks' which openly identifies a week's value (....unlike RCI) and has a "search first" capability (like II) and is less expensive than either one AND incorporates the best (and none of the worst) features of BOTH is BOUND to succeed --- but not overnight!

kathleenc103

Sometimes it hard to tell what's top tier even here on Red Week. We own at Shawnee Ridge Top week 8 which is a red week and The Royal Haciendas Week 48 in Mexico which is a brand new 5 star resort and also a red week by Cozemel and is a Royal resort which means quality and service. ==================================

Kathleen, Sorry I guess I didn't make my statement clear enough!

I'm not insulting anyones timeshare because as jayjay pointed out we do not own a top tier. I would never spend that kind of money for seven day stay a year anywhere!

What I do own is two units at the Ridge Tahoe Tower and Naegle building which are considered the top two units at the Ridge Tahoe!

We have traveled over the years to many places and sold our Ridge Tahoe Tower and left timesharing for about ten years before returning in 2005.

We have stayed in nice resorts for different reasons and most resorts have something nice about them or the area.

What I am saying has nothing to do with the amount of money someone paid having anything to do with the rating. With resales you can buy nice units very cheap.

But the top tier resorts cost much more even in resales.

I feel by top tier I was talking about Marriotts, Westins, Disney, Four Seasons and other big name companies in areas like Maui and other top resort area's that most of us can't trade into.

We love our resort and think its one of the best we have ever spent a week at again for many reasons from the resort to the area and II will tell you this about the Ridge Tahoe too!

Some resorts like the Ridge Tahoe have lakes ,casino's, live shows,water skiing,snow skiing and more! Most top tier are ocean front resorts.

The top tier are big name hotels that have their own system for owners plus belong to II all over the world.

Years ago when timeshares really had bad name these companies joined in the timeshare business and problably saved timesharing.

They are couple steps ahead of other nice resorts and this is fine because we all buy what fits our family needs and income so we can have years of family vacations.

Please, don't get me wrong. I absolutely LOVE RW's exchange system. I think it is a wonderful idea and I sincerely hope it does well. This is a great alternative and I'm extremely appreciative of that.

Also know, I do have faith in RW or I wouldn't have deposited my week already. I was just hoping more deposits would have shown up by now. I know, patience. And believe me, I do have a lot of that.

jayjay wrote:

......You have to remember that Redweek's exchange program is only 2 months old (began June 21, 2007). Any new venture takes time for the word to spread. I think it will one day rise to it's potential.

I was quoted points by RedWeek on the 11th of June and deposited my week on the 12th. The program actually began a few prior to that. It was a quiet "soft" opening before the mass email went out. Us early depostors knew the email was coming.

Anyhow, I too have been very disappointed with the lack of action. I have seen weeks come online that have rent much lower than mine being offered for more points than I was given. I now think I got a bum deal and wish I hadn't deposited with RedWeek.

I almost feel like I was penalized for deposting early. JMHO

Re: >> I have seen weeks come online that have rent much lower than mine being offered for more points than I was given. << ======================================

Sorry to appear dense, but I have no idea what you are saying here:

"come online"? ......where, in what particular context? "rent much lower than mine / offered for more points"??

I just can't grasp /comprehend exactly what you are trying to say with the mixed reference to rent / points.

Absent any further clarification, I do hope that your (apparent) comparisons are apples with apples, not apples with oranges. Different weeks in the very same unit at the very same resort will obviously have very different value (whether in rental dollars in the marketplace or in RedWeek points), depending on the specific week involved.

Can you more clearly elaborate?

ken1193 wrote:

Re: >> I have seen weeks come online that have rent much lower than mine being offered for more points than I was given. << ======================================

Sorry to appear dense, but I have no idea what you are saying here:

"come online"? ......where, in what particular context? "rent much lower than mine / offered for more points"??

I just can't grasp /comprehend exactly what you are trying to say with the mixed reference to rent / points.

Absent any further clarification, I do hope that your (apparent) comparisons are apples with apples, not apples with oranges. Different weeks in the very same unit at the very same resort will obviously have very different value (whether in rental dollars in the marketplace or in RedWeek points), depending on the specific week involved.

Can you more clearly elaborate?

========= We often wander in our discussions, but since this IS the forum Topic for REDWEEKS own exchange system, I presume that is where the weeks in question came on line: as deposits in the Redweek exchange program. And our friend above feels that weeks deposited after his were given higher point values by RW than his, even though he has seen those resorts rent for less than his does AND he was an early depositer. Is that right? MD

Re: >> I presume that is where the weeks in question came on line: as deposits in the Redweek exchange program. And our friend above feels that weeks deposited after his were given higher point values by RW than his, even though he has seen those resorts rent for less than his does AND he was an early depositer. << =======================================

Your assumptions may be correct, but I'm not personally inclined to "assume". I was hoping for a more detailed clarification directly from the original poster, since some critical info is missing.

I'm particularly puzzled by the "rent value" reference, without any accompanying indication that s/he is actually comparing the exact same weeks, in units of directly comparable size, at the same resort. If so, there is solid basis for further analysis and discussion. If not, it's just a subjective comparison of apples vs. oranges. As stated already, all weeks simply are not of the same "value" --- even in the very same unit at at the very same resort.

Moreover, are the "rent values" referenced derived just from advertisements (which can and do range from realistic to, shall we say, "very optimistic"), or are they figures KNOWN to have actually been PAID as rent?

C'mon terry314.... step and up and help us to better understand the factual basis of your "disappointment".

Sorry for the rambling and not making myself more clear. Adahiscout, You are correct, however.

I was one of the original depositors with RedWeek. I turned in a 3BR 3BA Christie Lodge week, reserved for March 15-22, 2008. Christie Lodge is a resort in Avon, CO, next to Beaver Creek ski resort. The Christie Lodge charges $409/nt for this room, but of course this date is not available.

I was offered, accepted, and received 1800 RW points for my week. It just so happens that I had that week listed for rent at $1799 on RedWeeks website. I accepted a rental offer of $1599 (was asking $1799) for the same week last year.

Early on, most discussions on this BB and on TugBBS seemed to think that the points being offered were similar to fair market rental value. That obviously is no longer the case. I now see people getting 2017 points for 2BR units that rent for about $800 on the web.

It is common for people to get RW points equal to 1-1/2 to 2 times the rental rates.

Example: Look at Plantation Resort of Myrtle Beach http://www.redweek.com/resort/P2028 I was talking to the owner of a 2BR on this BB when he was contemplating making his deposit. I told him he should take the 2017 points based on what I could see. He did and has since used some of his points. I went to his resort’s website and checked their rental rates. Boy was I surprised to find that anyone could rent a 2BR unit in the summer months for about $130/nt - directly from the resort!!

Based on those kinds of numbers, I should have been offered many more points. I truly believe that had I waited to deposit now, RedWeek WOULD offer me more points, as they badly need good deposits. That’s what I was talking about when I said, “I wish I hadn’t deposited with RedWeek.”

RedWeek offered me about 2900 points for my Marriott Waiohai. Thank God I didn’t deposit that one!

Terry

PS – His week and mine are still available as RedWeek exchanges.

It took me about two minutes to find another example.

Morritt's Tortuga Club http://www.redweek.com/resort/P53

Exchange Dec. 8 = 1441 points Rent Dec. 1 - $699

It's making me more and more upset as I write!!

I deposited my Las Vegas week on Aug. 2nd. I was offered 1450 points for it. This week was available for usage in 2009. Btw, this week has already been taken.

I deposited this week almost TWO YEARS prior to the check-in date. Yet, I see weeks deposited that are offered a decent amount of points for such short notice. What gives?

Therefore, I tend to agree with the above poster. I HAVE noticed deposited weeks are now getting more points.

Didn't I read something about how priority was going to be given to early depositers?

So, tell me. How is this exchange system fair to the early depositers?

Just a few relevant observations of fact on this subject (followed by a bit of my own personal opinion):

1. Rentals directly by the resort (....ANY resort) are generally the highest rental prices to be found ANYWHERE. Personally, I can't imagine who would pay those figures. They ARE renting on behalf of some owner --- and then taking 25-30% from that rental figure as their commission. Maybe that's part of the inflated rental figure. Private rentals are virtually always less money (as they must be, really, to get rented at all).

2. To my knowledge, RedWeek has NEVER asserted that their "points" allocation figures are (or are intended to be) actually equivalent to "dollars". Many have made this assumption or reached this conclusion, but it is NOT (and it has never been) RedWeek's own representation.

3. Different owners have very different concepts and needs regarding rental figures. In any given year, someone might just not be using their unit THIS year (and, understandably, DON'T want to give it to RCI). Such folks might regard any rental amount which pays the maintenance fee for that year to be adequate, and anything more than that to be "gravy". Each and every private rental is individual and different.

4. Both "availability" and "desrability" certainly factor into the value assigned by RW (and/or any other exchange company). In a "transparent" system, it wouldn't seem (to me) to matter much WHEN (how far in advance) the deposit gets made. "Desirable" will always prevail and will get snapped up regardless of advance time frame. "Less desirable" will sit longer without much interest, again regardless of advance time frame.

5. In ANY exchange system, it's ultimately all about the available inventory and the quality thereof. Personally, I'm not clear from some of these "disappointment" posts whether the reported dissatisfaction stems from a belated issue with valuation (you knew right up front the point value being offered, before depositing, no?) --or whether the dissatisfaction arises from the apparent absence of anything you want to exchange INTO.

I have "no dog in this fight" and I certainly don't represent (or in any other way speak for) RedWeek. That very clearly stated, the RedWeek exchange sysyem IS now just about exactly **8 weeks old**. Accordingly, the new program can hardly be expected to be perfect. Certainly NONE of the other exchange companies are perfect either, despite having existed for DECADES now. Some, actually, (and RCI springs immediately to mind as a specific and wonderful example) have gotten nothing but consistently worse and worse and worse --- to say the very least.

I sincerely hope that you folks succeed in accomplishing whatever it is that you specifically sought to achieve in the new RedWeek exchange program. I do believe however, that you really do have to take a step back and consider and acknowledge that RedWeek's exchange system is now just **8 WEEKS OLD**!!

You are intrepid pioneers in a brand new enterprise, one which might be reasonably expected to take longer than just 8 weeks to work out its kinks.........

ken1193 wrote:

Just a few relevant observations of fact on this subject (followed by a bit of my own personal opinion):

1. Rentals directly by the resort (....ANY resort) are generally the highest rental prices to be found ANYWHERE. Personally, I can't imagine who would pay those figures. They ARE renting on behalf of some owner --- and then taking 25-30% from that rental figure as their commission. Maybe that's part of the inflated rental figure. Private rentals are virtually always less money (as they must be, really, to get rented at all).

2. To my knowledge, RedWeek has NEVER asserted that their "points" allocation figures are (or are intended to be) actually equivalent to "dollars". Many have made this assumption or reached this conclusion, but it is NOT (and it has never been) RedWeek's own representation.

3. Different owners have very different concepts and needs regarding rental figures. In any given year, someone might just not be using their unit THIS year (and, understandably, DON'T want to give it to RCI). Such folks might regard any rental amount which pays the maintenance fee for that year to be adequate, and anything more than that to be "gravy". Each and every private rental is individual and different.

I agree with Ken. Why is it assumed that Redweek points are based on ultra high resort rental rates that few, if any people, would pay with all the discount rental sites on the internet (expedia, travelocity, orbitz, hotline, travelzoo, hotels.com, hotwire, priceline, sidestep and many other less reknown sites)?

And, most owners who rent their timeshares on Redweek don't rent at the resort's rental rates. If they quoted those rates, a person could easily rent from the resort itself. That's why many people buy and rent timeshares from owners, myself included.

I would think the quoted high rental rates from resorts are there to entice people into BUYING timeshares. Anybody that would pay a resort's quoted rental rate is out in the ozone.

Has Redweek ever stated that their ponts system is based on resort rental rates? If so, I haven't seen it.

I think I know where this myth was started and by whom and it's someone who knows nothing about timeshares. This person paid 100K for one week of timeshare in Vegas (duh) and he has no business spouting assumptions concerning Redweek's exchange system, but some people take his word as gospel.

terry314 wrote:

It took me about two minutes to find another example.

Morritt's Tortuga Club http://www.redweek.com/resort/P53

Exchange Dec. 8 = 1441 points Rent Dec. 1 - $699

It's making me more and more upset as I write!!

I have a thought for you that might help. When I checked into what my resorts would be worth on Red Week (points) I never heard of this provisional deposit that I now see listed. If you also didn't know about that at the time of deposit talk to them about this and see if you can be switched to that. This would give you access to your week again. I didn't deposit so I have no idea if that was offered before you deposited your resort week. Good Luck

Ken - You mention "desirability", "availability", "inflated rental figures", etc...

Truth is, one can determine the worth of a particular unit on a particular week by watching the rental histories on sites like RedWeek.com, myresortnetwork.com & sellmytimesharenow.com. Supply and demand determines rental rates. Supply and demand determines tradability. It’s that simple. You may have a lesser quality unit at a good location with a good date and beat a very high quality unit elsewhere in tradability. Rental rate histories WOULD be reflective of this as well.

You guys are putting WAY to much emphasis on my comment about the resorts’ rental rates. I KNOW THEY ARE INFLATED! I am NOT talking about resorts’ rental rates.

All I am saying is that being a “pioneer” in RedWeek’s exchange program has cost me points. THERE WAS NO PROVISIONAL WEEK OPTION AT THAT TIME. My 3BR ski week in March has more demand, based on rental histories, than does Plantation Resort of Myrtle Beach. I can rent my week out for $1600, on RedWeek’s site no less, and use that money to rent TWO weeks at Plantation Resort. Yet, that person received more points than I did. Consequently, I can't even reserve his week without paying $217 to buy more points - plus the exchange fee!

I would definitely have done a provisional week if it were offered back then. Then again, if everyone did a provisional week, there would be ZERO weeks available. I now feel penalized by making my week available, that’s all.

NO, RedWeek never said that points equaled rental dollars. This was assumed by many based on the early points being offered. It is now clear I was wrong.

terry314 wrote:

All I am saying is that being a “pioneer” in RedWeek’s exchange program has cost me points. THERE WAS NO PROVISIONAL WEEK OPTION AT THAT TIME.

If your week hasn't been taken, why don't you email Redweek to see if you can change your week to provisional since that option supposedly wasn't available when you deposited it? Have you tried that?

jayjay wrote:

If your week hasn't been taken, why don't you email Redweek to see if you can change your week to provisional since that option supposedly wasn't available when you deposited it? Have you tried that?

I have been emailing back and forth to Kylie about this program since June, offering my opinions and feedback. I must admit they have been very responsive.

I asked her three days ago about the possibily of getting my week back. She was very disappointed that I had "given up" on them so quickly. I did not ask about converting to a provisional week, however.

I guess, i do not see how this program can ever work if all the weeks are provisional and not actual deposits. YOU HAVE TO REWARD THOSE WHO DEPOSIT FIRST. ie bonus weeks or points. Example, deposit this week and get an extra 700 points to be used on your second exchange.

Truth is, by reading on TugBBS, it has become obvious that most of the provional weeks are just people testing the RedWeek system. I have read that many people don't even own the weeks they were getting quotes for!

A software program needs to be put in place that "ties" many weeks together and commits people to their provisional weeks. Otherwise, we are going to watch green grass turn brown, I am afraid.

I did commit my unit to RedWeek, so I do feel I should live up to my end of the deal. I do also feel, however, that the rules have changed since then, and that I should be compensated accordingly.

I have even thought about paying the $125 and buying my unit back from RedWeek and then renting it out. I am afraid I may run into problems at my resort when I call to give them the name of the renters. I bet if I explained the issue to my resort, they would understand.

Quote:

Truth is, by reading on TugBBS, it has become obvious that most of the provional weeks are just people testing the RedWeek system. I have read that many people don't even own the weeks they were getting quotes for!

You have to take what is said many times on Tug with a grain of salt. Posts there are merely opinions of the poster, not timeshare gospel written in stone.

It was a Tug member who bought the 100K one week of timeshare in (drastically overbuilt) Vegas and bragged about his fantastic negotiating skills in getting that great deal even though Tug's mantra has always been to never to buy from the developer but to buy resale. Anyone who buys one week of timeshare and pays 100K needs their head examined bigtime. He is also the main detractor of Redweek's exchange program.

There are many knowledgable members on Tug (DaveM is a good example), and then there are members that don't know diddly about timesharing (the idiot who paid 100K for one week of timeshare is a perfect example). You have to decipher who are the knowlegable members versus the BSers and whose posts you should believe versus whose posts to completely ignore as untruths and ignorance.

You have to remember that Tug is a very small population of timeshare owners (somewhat like a grain of sand on a thousand mile beach), and I don't believe that most of the provisional weeks are coming from Tuggers (a small group). I believe most provisional weeks are coming from Redweek members themselves.

And yes, you can request the number of Redweek points a week will receive whether or not you own the week. There's nothing wrong with that. And I don't doubt that most provisional weeks are people testing Redweek's waters. This is all new to them and Redweek needs time to build their program just like RCI and II had to do in the beginning. It's still in it's infancy.