Help— owner doesn’t use rental agreements

I’m trying to rent a time share in Orlando for the first time through Redweek. It is not a verified listing, but it is the only one with the right dates and size. I asked the owner for copy of the rental agreement or whether he would use an escrow company. He said that he does not use rental agreements. He takes a deposit through PayPal and when the reservation shows in my name, he wants the balance through PayPal. I could use your help! Could he change the reservation once I’ve paid?

eileenh177 wrote:

I’m trying to rent a time share in Orlando for the first time through Redweek. It is not a verified listing, but it is the only one with the right dates and size. I asked the owner for copy of the rental agreement or whether he would use an escrow company. He said that he does not use rental agreements. He takes a deposit through PayPal and when the reservation shows in my name, he wants the balance through PayPal. I could use your help! Could he change the reservation once I’ve paid?

You don't identify the resort or the system involved in this prospective rental but generally speaking, any owner has the right to change a reservation at any time prior to occupancy date. That being said, someone who is a paid RedWeek member who has paid additional money to place an a rental ad on Redweek is (in my opinion) highly unlikely to be dishonest or a scammer.

Nonetheless, one has to wonder why any owner would decline to execute a formal rental agreement. One major problem for you as the prospective tenant is that with no contract, you have no idea of the owner's policy or intentions in the event that you have to cancel before occupancy, for whatever reason. Additionally, if the ad / owner is not already "RedWeek verified", do you somehow have other proof or documentation that the person offering this rental is, in fact, the actual owner of the week being offered, with the legal standing and authority to even be conducting this rental at all in the first place?

It is my belief and personal experience over a fair number of years now (on both sides of RedWeek rentals) that 99.9% of all rentals on RedWeek are completely legitimate and conducted by honest owners. That being said, you have to make a personal decision whether you want to "roll the dice" on that remaining tiny minority in the absence of a formal rental agreement / contract. An owner who won't provide (or participate in) a mutually signed formal rental agreement spelling out all pertinent details of the rental (including clearly stated cancellation / refund terms, conditions and time frame) is an owner with whom I personally would not choose to do business, but that's ultimately a personal choice and decision that you need to make for yourself.

Thank you very much. No, I do not have proof that the homeowner owns the unit. How do you go about finding out? Simply ask? Many thanks again!

eileenh177 wrote:

No, I do not have proof that the homeowner owns the unit. How do you go about finding out? Simply ask?

You can. If the owner is legit and is serious about renting it out, he should have no problem furnishing you with information to keep you comfortable.

eileenh177 wrote:

Thank you very much. No, I do not have proof that the homeowner owns the unit. How do you go about finding out? Simply ask? Many thanks again!

1. You can call the resort directly. To protect owner privacy, the resort absolutely will never disclose any information, but if you already have the owner's name and identification of the specific unit / week involved, most resorts will at least confirm that the person is indeed the owner of that particular unit / week (but will reveal absolutely nothing more).

2. You can ask the owner for a copy of the most recent maintenance fee bill. This is a document that could of course be forged, but with that document in hand you can go right back to item 1. above to get confirmation of its' legitimacy directly from the resort.

P.S. One benefit of being RedWeek "verified" is that the owner'd legitimacy and accuracy of unit / week ownership claim is independently[/] confirmed by RedWeek. It frankly escapes me why an owner would fail to pony up the extra $14.95 to be independently "verified" by RedWeek, for a rental that usually involves at least several hundred dollars. That's just being "penny wise and pound foolish", at least in my own personal opinion.

You can also request to have a phone conversation with the advertising owner. That conversation may or may not give you some additional confidence and assurance regarding their legitimacy. If they won't even talk to you person to person, that seems very suspicious (to me, anyhow) in and of itself.

If the advertising owner is resistant to all of these suggestions, I respectfully submit that you should think long and hard about whether you want to do business with them at all. A contract protects the owner as much as the tenant, so it's very hard for me to comprehend why any legitimate owner would ever balk at executing a formal, mutually signed (and mutually protective) rental agreement / contract.

Just my own thoughts and personal opinion, for whatever they may be worth, based upon my own 35+ years of timeshare ownership and experience. I have been on both sides of RedWeek rental transactions on many different occasions. Exercising care, caution and due diligence (and always using a rental agreement, no matter which side of the transaction I'm on), I have never encountered a problem being on either side of a RedWeek-advertised rental.

Thank you fir your help!

The owner has given me his phone number to explain his policy so I'll see what he has to say or offer. I will ask him for a copy of the most recent maintenance bill and will call the resort to confirm that he is the owner of that week and unit. As I haven't spoken to him, I don't know why he won't sign a contract (and I agree that it protects both sides). He will accept PayPal (and we're about 60 days out). Does that give any layer of protection?

Many thanks for your thoughts!

Patagonia: You can view the pro's and con's of each payment type on this page: Payment Method Comparison (https://www.redweek.com/resources/payment-method-comparison)

Although we do not vouch for or recommend any person using our website, if you Contact Us (support@redweek.com) we can let you know how long this person has been a RedWeek member and if we have any complaints on their account.

eileenh177 wrote:

He will accept PayPal (and we're about 60 days out). Does that give any layer of protection?

For him, yes. For you, no. A payment received via PayPal can be immediately moved into a bank account by the recipient. From that moment forward, the difficulty of future retrieval of funds (or any portion thereof) is exponentially more difficult and much less likely. Tread carefully.

Please share what this owner has to say about declining to offer or participate in a formal rental contract --- that should be a very interesting story indeed. That said, in all fairness, at 60 days out it is not at all unreasonable for an owner to adopt and enforce a "no refunds upon cancellation" posture. After all, the odds of advertising and finding another renter within that ever-decreasing time frame are not really on his side. Last minute air fares to some locations can be absurdly expensive too and most working people like to (and / or must) plan their vacation time and travel further in advance that.

Thank you all for your help. I had an extended conversation with the owner who is an older person. He tells me that he has a number of timeshares and as the cost has gone up he has rented this way to cover costs. He feels that through conversation both parties will feel comfortable, and says that he has never had a problem. I checked the reservation under his name at the resort as some of you suggested, and the owner's name, date and unit size are as promised. Having said that, could it be cancelled even if the reservation was changed to my name?

60 days out I agree that the cancellation policy should be upheld, and I would buy cancellation insurance, but I can't buy coverage, I don't think, if we go down and the unit isn't there.

eileenh177 wrote:

I checked the reservation under his name at the resort as some of you suggested, and the owner's name, date and unit size are as promised. Having said that, could it be cancelled even if the reservation was changed to my name?

As previously stated, an owner can put a reservation in whatever name(s) he or she chooses, whenever he or she chooses. Short of the resort being closed (due to hurricane damage, fire, etc.) or an owner failing to have paid his / her maintenance fees before the occupancy date, there aren't many (if any) other scenarios in which a reservation would just be unilaterally "cancelled".

Bear in mind too that any owner who took money from someone and then failed to provide the "product" would be committing a crime. Larceny over $300 is a felony crime in most states (although the absence of a contract certainly complicates the burden of proof).

If you've had a conversation with the owner and the names and the facts all match, there really isn't much more that you can do if the owner refuses to participate in a rental contract (a refusal which I personally find very strange and also totally unacceptable, but YMMV). I guess you'll have to just go with your "gut" in making your decision.

Hi Patagonia,

On the Timeshare Users Group (TUG) website there are some examples of rental agreements:

https://tug2.net/timeshare_advice/free-timeshare-owner-advice-articles.html#rent