BUYING DEVELOPER vs RESALE (typical scenario)

I am considering buying a timeshhare reslae. i am trying to determine if there is any difference between the exact same item being sold by 2 different sellers at 2 totally different prices, one is $999 and one is $8,999. Is there no difference, they both are 3 bedroom, one floating week annually. This is at the Grand Beach resort in Orlando Fl.

she2 wrote:

I am considering buying a timeshhare reslae. i am trying to determine if there is any difference between the exact same item being sold by 2 different sellers at 2 totally different prices, one is $999 and one is $8,999. Is there no difference, they both are 3 bedroom, one floating week annually. This is at the Grand Beach resort in Orlando Fl.

============== For starters the unit listed for sale at $999 has a limited usage (weeks 1-4, 18-20, 36-45, 48-49). Under the HELP section there are links to timeshare calendars to see the exact dates. These dates not include typical school vacation periods or holidays. If your plan was to use it with your children during school vacation, this unit might not work for you. Rentals or exchanges might also be limited. The buyer is also responsible for the 2008 MF of $880, bringing the actual price to almost $1900. The owner is probably just anxious to sell to get out of paying the high MF every year. If you do not have kids and/or plan on vacationing during the non-peak weeks, then this unit might be a good fit since you can travel during non-peak times. If you plan on exchanging, here’s a word of caution…just because the ad states it is an RCI Red Week, doesn’t mean that you can exchange into any other RCI Red week. There are various shades of Red and a non-peak Orlando week would not have the same trading power as a Spring Break week. You may have difficulty exchanging into places like Hawaii and Aruba. This resort is part of Diamond Resorts system (previously Sunterra) and is one of a group of 19 resorts in a Florida Trust. It sounds like this is a deeded week at the resort rather than a deeded week in the Florida Trust where you would get “SunOption” points to be used for exchanging into other resorts in the Trust.

There is not a lot of information about the second unit, except that it is being listed by Second Market Timeshare Resales. I don't know whether they are an upfront fee company or if they collect a commission. You need to check the usage for this unit. Are there any usage limitations, such as the ones listed for the $999 unit? Is it a deeded week in the previously mentioned Trust? If so, then how many SunOption Points do you get? Has the 2008 MF been paid? I noticed the MF is much lower than the other unit. In either case, determine if the MFs listed are accurate and try to find out if there are any upcoming assessments. The second ad says make an offer, so if you find you like the $8900 unit better, go ahead and make an offer. Good Luck

she2 wrote:

I am considering buying a timeshhare reslae. i am trying to determine if there is any difference between the exact same item being sold by 2 different sellers at 2 totally different prices, one is $999 and one is $8,999. Is there no difference, they both are 3 bedroom, one floating week annually. This is at the Grand Beach resort in Orlando Fl.

There's absolutely no difference. The probable reason that one person is asking $8,999 is, more than likely, because they bought from the developer and are wanting their money back on the resale market (they're dreaming).

The $999 ad was more than likely bought on the resale market and that's all the seller wants out of it.

Same product, different types of purchase (one developer and one resale). That's why you see such discrepencies in price for the same timeshare in the resale marketplace.

You're very wise to peruse the resale market for what you want as you can save a TON of money by doing so.

jayjay wrote:

she2 wrote:

I am considering buying a timeshhare reslae. i am trying to determine if there is any difference between the exact same item being sold by 2 different sellers at 2 totally different prices, one is $999 and one is $8,999. Is there no difference, they both are 3 bedroom, one floating week annually. This is at the Grand Beach resort in Orlando Fl.

There's absolutely no difference. The probable reason that one person is asking $8,999 is, more than likely, because they bought from the developer and are wanting their money back on the resale market (they're dreaming).

The $999 ad was more than likely bought on the resale market and that's all the seller wants out of it.

Same product, different types of purchase (one developer and one resale). That's why you see such discrepencies in price for the same timeshare in the resale marketplace.

You're very wise to peruse the resale market for what you want as you can save a TON of money by doing so.

========= Jayjay, while $8900 is way overpriced, there could be differences in these two units. They are both listed as floating weeks, but the $999 TS is for off-peak usage. The other unit may be available 52 weeks of the year. Also, is the $8900 TS a deeded week in the Florida Trust. Either of these could increase the resale value of a unit, though not by 8 grand.

mike1536 wrote:

Jayjay, while $8900 is way overpriced, there could be differences in these two units. They are both listed as floating weeks, but the $999 TS is for off-peak usage. The other unit may be available 52 weeks of the year. Also, is the $8900 TS a deeded week in the Florida Trust. Either of these could increase the resale value of a unit, though not by 8 grand.

She had mentioned that they both were annual floating weeks, so that's what I was going by (I didn't look up the ad), but yes it could make a difference if the floating designation was different but not an 8K difference.

Need some help understanding this a bit better as we just got back from Orlando and a large resort timeshare presentation. They offered us a 2bath/2bedroom one for $16,999 and the other for $23,900 the difference being location. Both of these were a week we would not usually travel in because we have children but they said exchanging is no problem. Went into the whole thing about thye now are based on points. When I asked why I was seeing resales on the internet for $7,000 for the same property I was told that these are "deeded" weeks and can't be exchanged and will never be able to switch to the point system.

The 7,000K still seems high and I am seeing some even lower 2,800k but not the week we would need.

If anyone can help me understand this better it would be most appreciated.

C

carriec49 wrote:

Need some help understanding this a bit better as we just got back from Orlando and a large resort timeshare presentation. They offered us a 2bath/2bedroom one for $16,999 and the other for $23,900 the difference being location. Both of these were a week we would not usually travel in because we have children but they said exchanging is no problem. Went into the whole thing about thye now are based on points. When I asked why I was seeing resales on the internet for $7,000 for the same property I was told that these are "deeded" weeks and can't be exchanged and will never be able to switch to the point system.

The 7,000K still seems high and I am seeing some even lower 2,800k but not the week we would need.

If anyone can help me understand this better it would be most appreciated.

C

================ Carrie, Could you be more specific as to the name of the resort and what type of point system it uses (RCI, Fairfield, Diamond, etc). I'm also curious as to the location difference which would demand an extra $7000. Thanks Mike

mike1536 wrote:

carriec49 wrote:

Need some help understanding this a bit better as we just got back from Orlando and a large resort timeshare presentation. They offered us a 2bath/2bedroom one for $16,999 and the other for $23,900 the difference being location. Both of these were a week we would not usually travel in because we have children but they said exchanging is no problem. Went into the whole thing about thye now are based on points. When I asked why I was seeing resales on the internet for $7,000 for the same property I was told that these are "deeded" weeks and can't be exchanged and will never be able to switch to the point system.

The 7,000K still seems high and I am seeing some even lower 2,800k but not the week we would need.

If anyone can help me understand this better it would be most appreciated.

C

================ Carrie, Could you be more specific as to the name of the resort and what type of point system it uses (RCI, Fairfield, Diamond, etc). I'm also curious as to the location difference which would demand an extra $7000. Thanks Mike

Hi Mike, It was at Orange Lake we stayed. They use RCI but they now are using a company that contacts RCI direct Global something. The east unit which we stayed in is the one they quoted the lower price. The higher price is in their new unit over at the River complex. They are building 2 more huge buildings and I just don't see how the pool/river area now can handle those 2 buildings.

If you have any tips on other time share places we should look at please let me know. We really like the idea and would like to have something while our girls are young. I know what I spend on vacations so this seems a more resonable way to go for us.

Thanks Carrie

I have learned just from verbal conversation at the different resorts that you should only by resale and I could not agree more. This is how I do it. I would take a $25000 unit new and divide it out by what the maintence fees are to get a weekly total of what it would cost me per year for only one week!! Then I go to the resales and see how many I can buy all over the world for that amount of money and have many to trade and more trading power with the exchange companies. I picked my first one up its a lock off at Sheraton Vistana Resort float week-Cascades for a resale and I paid under $2000-my second 1 bedroom Cascades was under $1000 and my third 2 bedroom Lakes was under $750.00 all resales in the new section of the resort. I have had more benefits buying resale than someone buying new because I have 3 units and they only have one ! Resale is totally the way to go .. I get 3-4 vacations a year for a minimul total of about $1500.00 (3 fees combined). Don't buy new you are crazy.

What you do is find out if this is a float week or a fixed week. I only buy float weeks. I would not buy into Grand Beach but buy into either Sheraton Vistana Resort - Lakes or Cascades now as all the refurbishment costs have been paid by most owners I know I paid them already but the units are gorgeous and the resort has endless things to offer. Grand Beach is very quiet and really much for families . Another to consider is Orange Lake in Kissimme . Great resort and you can always upgrade a small fee to a 3 bedroom as an owner. We stayed in WEst Village in June and it was great. It has so much to offer and do. Also the Sheraton and Orange Lake are easy to resell if you need to. Your location of Sheraton Vistana REsort in regards to Grand Beach is the same so go with the one that will rent or sell SVR. Hope this helped. I would not pay over $8000 for this unit you can pick up 5 units for that price in Sheraton or Orange lake.

Buy resale , float weeks 1-52 or prime weeks, buy into resorts that have alot of amenities like Sheraton Vistana Resort or Orange Lake (as an owner you can upgrade to a 3 bedroom if available). First of all you can rent these out if you don't use your weeks, secondly you can sell them at either what you paid or more you won't loose.I own 3 resales and would NEVER EVER buy new. I have had endles vacations with my family all on resales or just exchanging with RCI.. If you are willing to pay $25000 for one then I would buy 1 at Sheraton- 2 bedroom -Float-Lakes or Cascades, your 2nd at Orange Lake- EAst or WEst Village Studio( you can exchange to a 2 or 3) and one at Hilton 2 bedroom-all floats. These 3 should only cost you a grand total of about $7000.00 maybe or less.. This way you get around that 1 in 4 year rule where you now you can go anytime as owners are exempt. Orlando is my second home I am there 4 times per year and have stayed in all of these with friends and family and the reviews are 5*. If you join RCI then buy smaller units because you can exchange to large ones and you will save on your M-Fees and also on your purchase price.. Any questions you can email me . ADvise -Don't buy new buy resale!

bonniea16 wrote:

Buy resale , float weeks 1-52 or prime weeks, buy into resorts that have alot of amenities like Sheraton Vistana Resort or Orange Lake (as an owner you can upgrade to a 3 bedroom if available). First of all you can rent these out if you don't use your weeks, secondly you can sell them at either what you paid or more you won't loose.I own 3 resales and would NEVER EVER buy new. I have had endles vacations with my family all on resales or just exchanging with RCI.. If you are willing to pay $25000 for one then I would buy 1 at Sheraton- 2 bedroom -Float-Lakes or Cascades, your 2nd at Orange Lake- EAst or WEst Village Studio( you can exchange to a 2 or 3) and one at Hilton 2 bedroom-all floats. These 3 should only cost you a grand total of about $7000.00 maybe or less.. This way you get around that 1 in 4 year rule where you now you can go anytime as owners are exempt. Orlando is my second home I am there 4 times per year and have stayed in all of these with friends and family and the reviews are 5*. If you join RCI then buy smaller units because you can exchange to large ones and you will save on your M-Fees and also on your purchase price.. Any questions you can email me . ADvise -Don't buy new buy resale!

========= Bonnie has provided some great insight. Orange Lake has their own Point system for exchanging into other Orange Lake properties (see orangelake.com). If you bought an Orange Lake property resale, you probably would not be in their internal point system, though the resort might allow you to join at a later date (for a fee). Orange Lake is also an RCI Points resort and this uses a different point system. Either system gives you flexibility for exchanges since you can take smaller units or trips of less than or greater than 7 days. If Orange Lake recently converted to RCI Points, then if you bought resale, the unit would revert back to a traditional ‘weeks’ resort. You’d have to pay another fee to convert it back to RCI Points. My suggestion, your first TS, is to buy where you want to go every year. If you don't want to go to the same place every year consider a biennial unit. Buy a 2 bedroom unit (I like a lock-off feature) and be sure the unit you purchase can be used for the dates you want to travel. Some units have limited usage, for example a "value week" probably would not include school vacation periods. Buying a high demand week may be a bit pricier, but there will probably be more exchange availabilities and it might be easier to rent or sell in the future. A word of caution. Don't fall into the RED week "trap". All of Florida is considered RED time. But, there are various shades of RED (spring break is in much more demand than the last week of January). Just because you own RED in Florida, doesn't mean you can exchange into a week in Hawaii. It doesn’t mean you can’t, it just might be more difficult (and frustrating).

If your willing to spend a bit more (even for resale), you might want to check out the Disney Vacation Club. They also work on a point system, but that is my extent of my knowledge. Marriott also seems to be a good choice, but I think maintenance fees for both of these tend to be higher than average.

There is a lot of information on this site and at TUG. You’re doing the right thing in doing your homework now. Good Luck Mike

jayjay wrote:

The most expensive timeshare we ever bought was our first from the developer in a brand new area facing a waterpark (very coveted location) of a very popular gold crown resort in Florida, and we paid 10K for it. I thought 10K was outrageous. We were not educated about resales at the time we bought from the developer.

A few years later when we were ready to sell I advertised it for 5K (half price as I had read that no way would we get the developer purchase price back on a resale). I advertised it on several internet sites with no interest whatsoever. I kept dropping the price and finally got an offer of $2900 which I took and was glad to get it. We lost 7K on our developer bought timeshare, which is typical on the resale market.

We definitely learned a (very expensive) lesson concerning buying developer timeshares. We went on to buy 8 resales (at very good prices) where we liked to go. When we were ready to sell them, we had no problem at all since we bought at such good prices to begin with.

A tough way to learn about developer bought timeshares vs resales.

A resale timeshare is the exact same product as a developer timeshare and costs 1/4 to 1/3 of the developer cost.

JayJay & Bonnie, you seem to be very knowledgable about timeshares. My question is specifically about buying on the resale market. We have been visitng RedWeek daily and are seriously considering buying a floating week at one of the Florida Vistana resorts. Thank you for that input, Bonnie! It's scary buying sight unseen and I'm nervous about doing it on the internet. How can we be sure we are registered as owners with the resort? We're looking to buy even yrs prime week - not sure what "prime" week means? We're leaning towards biannual due to the annual fees being so high otherwise. It seems these locations would have high trade value... I assume we can join & use RCI?? This is all very confusing and intimidating to me. I see postings that say timeshares are a rip-off and a scam. I look at it as investing in our vacation time over the long haul and leaving something fun and intrinsically valuable to leave our children. Can anyone answer any of these questions and/or offer advice before we take the plunge??? Thank you so much in advance!

lisag314 wrote:

How can we be sure we are registered as owners with the resort?

lisa, when you find the resale you want to purchase, get in touch with the owner (email). When you have come to an agreement the owner will get in touch with a reliable closing company. The closing company will take care of all the paperwork and hold all monies in escrow until the transaction is complete. The closing company makes sure the transfer of the week is recorded with the county and with the resort (putting it in your name).

Quote:

We're looking to buy even yrs prime week - not sure what "prime" week means? We're leaning towards biannual due to the annual fees being so high otherwise

.

That's a good strategy if you don't plan to use your timeshare every year. Maintenance fees are high in Florida. As far as prime weeks go, most all of Florida is considered red (or prime), however there's different shades of red in Florida. There's the very busy weeks including holidays, spring break and summer. Then there's less busy times (re: early fall, some spring months and after the first of the year).

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It seems these locations would have high trade value...

Not necessarily since Orlando is over saturated with resorts and it's easy to trade into Orlando with most any timeshare one owns.

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I assume we can join & use RCI??

Sheraton Vistana is affiliated with both RCI and II. You can join either exchange company.

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This is all very confusing and intimidating to me. I see postings that say timeshares are a rip-off and a scam.

Timeshares can be a wise investment in quality vacations if you know exactly what you want, what you're willing to pay and understand the concept of timesharing. When one buys a timeshare with blinders on not knowing anything about timesharing, then yes, it can be intimidating and overwhelming, but if you do your homework (research) then you shouldn't be overwhelmed.

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I look at it as investing in our vacation time over the long haul and leaving something fun and intrinsically valuable to leave our children.

Exactly, timeshares are not a financial investment, they are an investment in quality family vacations.

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Can anyone answer any of these questions and/or offer advice before we take the plunge??? Thank you so much in advance!

There's a forum on Starwood (Vistana's point system) on Tug ( www.tugbbs.com ) with many knowledgabe members that can answer any question you might have regarding the Starwood (Vistana) resorts.

As far as buying from the internet, all but one of our timeshares were purchased via internet ad sites such as Redweek, however we knew exactly what we wanted and what we were willing to pay. When using a reliable closing company, there should be no problems. BTW, the buyer normally pays closing costs but that can be negotiable between buyer and seller.

If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

jayjay wrote:

lisag314 wrote:

How can we be sure we are registered as owners with the resort?

lisa, when you find the resale you want to purchase, get in touch with the owner (email). When you have come to an agreement the owner will get in touch with a reliable closing company. The closing company will take care of all the paperwork and hold all monies in escrow until the transaction is complete. The closing company makes sure the transfer of the week is recorded with the county and with the resort (putting it in your name).

Quote:

We're looking to buy even yrs prime week - not sure what "prime" week means? We're leaning towards biannual due to the annual fees being so high otherwise

.

That's a good strategy if you don't plan to use your timeshare every year. Maintenance fees are high in Florida. As far as prime weeks go, most all of Florida is considered red (or prime), however there's different shades of red in Florida. There's the very busy weeks including holidays, spring break and summer. Then there's less busy times (re: early fall, some spring months and after the first of the year).

Quote:

It seems these locations would have high trade value...

Not necessarily since Orlando is over saturated with resorts and it's easy to trade into Orlando with most any timeshare one owns.

Quote:

I assume we can join & use RCI??

Sheraton Vistana is affiliated with both RCI and II. You can join either exchange company.

Quote:

This is all very confusing and intimidating to me. I see postings that say timeshares are a rip-off and a scam.

Timeshares can be a wise investment in quality vacations if you know exactly what you want, what you're willing to pay and understand the concept of timesharing. When one buys a timeshare with blinders on not knowing anything about timesharing, then yes, it can be intimidating and overwhelming, but if you do your homework (research) then you shouldn't be overwhelmed.

Quote:

I look at it as investing in our vacation time over the long haul and leaving something fun and intrinsically valuable to leave our children.

Exactly, timeshares are not a financial investment, they are an investment in quality family vacations.

Quote:

Can anyone answer any of these questions and/or offer advice before we take the plunge??? Thank you so much in advance!

There's a forum on Starwood (Vistana's point system) on Tug ( www.tugbbs.com ) with many knowledgabe members that can answer any question you might have regarding the Starwood (Vistana) resorts.

As far as buying from the internet, all but one of our timeshares were purchased via internet ad sites such as Redweek, however we knew exactly what we wanted and what we were willing to pay. When using a reliable closing company, there should be no problems. BTW, the buyer normally pays closing costs but that can be negotiable between buyer and seller.

If you have any further questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

============== I'd like to expand on jayjay's reply regarding RCI and II (Interval International).

As jayjay said, Sheraton Vistana is affiliated with both RCI and II. Here is where it might get tricky. According to the RCI Resort Directory Sheraton Vistana is an RCI Points resort. This resort was probably in the traditional 'Weeks' system and converted to the 'Points' system. Some owners may have never converted over to Points and thus you may be able to join II for exchange purposes. Other owners may have converted to RCI Points, but these may revert back to the 'weeks' system on resale. If you join the RCI Points system, you probably cannot join II for exchanging, since RCI basically has control of your week in exchange for the Points. You would need to book into your home resort 12-13 months in advance of your week, after that your week is available to others. Also the RedWeek will not accept RCI Points resorts for their exchange program. So if you buy resale, you need to confirm if the unit is weeks or points and if the unit is in the 'points' system will it revert back to the 'weeks' system. If the unit you buy is not in the RCI Points system and you want to join an exchange company, I would recommend II. Their process is a bit more flexible than RCI's 'weeks' exchanges. Finally, Starwood has its own point system as well, so try to get info as to how that piece fits into the puzzle. Clear as mud? Good Luck Mike

she2 wrote:

I am considering buying a timeshhare reslae. i am trying to determine if there is any difference between the exact same item being sold by 2 different sellers at 2 totally different prices, one is $999 and one is $8,999. Is there no difference, they both are 3 bedroom, one floating week annually. This is at the Grand Beach resort in Orlando Fl.

Well, I have bought 3 timeshares at all different prices and a unit is a unit. The differenc is that maybe one bought years ago and doesn't really care what price they get they just want to rid themselves of the fees and the other might have bought recently and MUST get back what they paid or some of it . A 3 bedroom in Grande Beach I would say is a 3 bedroom really no price differenc just a price difference to the seller . Buy a studio at Orange Lake and you can upgrade with RCI to a 3 bedroom most times ..Hope this helped

We recently went to a Marriott sales presentation and were told that they will buy back our timeshare at market value if we decide at some future date we no longer require it. Has anyone ever had their timeshare bought back by Marriott at market value?

lloydh13 wrote:

We recently went to a Marriott sales presentation and were told that they will buy back our timeshare at market value if we decide at some future date we no longer require it. Has anyone ever had their timeshare bought back by Marriott at market value?

============= First, I would not believe anything the salesperson says unless it is specifically written in your purchase and sale agreement. That being said, Marriott can (in some cases) exercise a Right of First Refusal, but would only occur if you had a purchase agreement with another buyer. I guess this could be considered buying back a unit at a RESALE "market value". I haven't heard of Marriott just buying a unit, though they might do it with high demand units, especially if they know they can flip it for a quick resale at a higher cost. I can reasonably assure you that "market value" won't be what Marriott is currently selling units for.

lloydh13 wrote:

We recently went to a Marriott sales presentation and were told that they will buy back our timeshare at market value if we decide at some future date we no longer require it. Has anyone ever had their timeshare bought back by Marriott at market value?

We are Marriott owners and over the years have attended many Marriott timeshare sales presentations from Hilton Head to Hawaii and points in between (for the free gifts) and have never heard a Marriott salesman make a sales pitch that indicated Marriott would buy a newly purchased unit back at "market" at a future date.

I think the salesman was mistaken or purposely lied to close the deal. Get it in writing and have "market" defined. I suspect the salesman's concept of market is the resale market value which is considerably less than the developer price. As Jayjay has said, "if the salesman's mouth is moving he is lying". The only thing you can count on is what is written into the contract.

I never thought I would fall for a sales pitch for a timeshare but low and behold I did. I usually am the one saying, NO but for some reason, I said YES! I am now trying to learn the art of buying resale:)